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Terri Agnew's Personal Meeting Room - Shared screen with speaker view
julie.hedlund
07:19
Yes, Kathy there is sound.
julie.hedlund
07:28
You may wish to try to join again?
Maxim Alzoba
07:29
Hello all, Zoom sound is way better than Adobe
Kathy Kleiman
08:16
Maxim, agreed!
Kathy Kleiman
08:47
For all not on the last call, the moving of next week's call to Tuesday created a conflict for a number of participants.
Kathy Kleiman
08:59
It may or may not be true for this group and this time period.
Kathy Kleiman
09:08
TM claims is likely to meet on Thursday next week...
Kathy Kleiman
09:49
I want May Day off too!
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
10:44
I can do Thursday but only for 60 min
Susan Payne
10:51
I can't do Tuesday. I can do Weds or Thurs. My May Day is Monday 6th
Maxim Alzoba
11:07
2nd of May is a holiday week still, but better than 1st
Petter Rindforth
11:23
May 2 works for me
Maxim Alzoba
11:24
what is the time?
Kathy Kleiman
11:30
same time
Maxim Alzoba
11:45
18.00 UTC?
julie.hedlund
11:53
Yes, 18:00 UTC
Maxim Alzoba
12:10
will attend :(
Ariel Liang
12:13
You may download the summary table and scroll through on your own
Ariel Liang
12:28
Unfortunately Zoom does not allow scrolling
julie.hedlund
14:35
@All: We note that there are several unmuted microphones. Please check your microphone and mute it when you aren’t speaking. Thank you.
Ariel Liang
15:08
Page 8 of the document
julie.hedlund
15:37
@All: Claudio seems to be the phone line ending in 8208.
julie.hedlund
15:47
Now labeled.
Greg Shatan
15:59
If you don’t have a red slashed microphone next to your name you are a bad person (unless you are speaking).
julie.hedlund
17:14
@All: If you move the arrow/mouse over your name in the Participants list you should see an option to mute or unmute.
Maxim Alzoba
18:58
other registries, which are not affiliated by the TLDs mentioned are not responsible for actions or inactions of those TLDs
David McAuley
20:53
Thanks Claudio, I think the Walmart example is helpful to understand this
Maxim Alzoba
21:13
The question is , what happens to TM owner of Walm ?
Maxim Alzoba
21:36
does it mean the first TM is going to be recognized as a cybersquatter?
Maxim Alzoba
22:21
I will wait in the queue
Susan Payne
22:21
Maxim, is your eg any differentt to a scenario where two different Walmarts exist in different fields of activity
Maxim Alzoba
23:29
.merck ?
Maxim Alzoba
24:44
@Susan, it is different, extending the rights beyond what exist in the real world
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
25:00
I can see maybe making the UDRP effective for this, but it seems harsh to offer proactive protections in these situations.
julie.hedlund
25:16
@Maxim: If you were trying to speak we note that your microphone is muted.
Maxim Alzoba
25:36
I was not so fast to start speaking :(
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
25:38
@John, thank you, that makes a lot of sense.
julie.hedlund
26:01
@David: Maxim is back in the queue.
Maxim Alzoba
26:05
my hand is still up, and I still eager to speak
David McAuley
26:09
Maxim - how bout I come to you next?
Maxim Alzoba
26:13
yes
Maxim Alzoba
26:19
it would be great
David McAuley
26:36
Kathy - I will come to Maxim and then you
Zak Muscovitch
30:37
Is there any issue with a generic term being the latter part of a trademark, such as Canadian.club (CANADIAN CLUB) or Africa.dev (AFRICA DEV), resulting in tm owners using sunrise to get domain names which correspond to a term which they dont own apart from the descriptive or generic term? Thinking out loud here...
David McAuley
31:05
Zak - do you want to mention or want me to read chat?
Zak Muscovitch
31:20
Sure, I will ask
David McAuley
31:27
ok - after Kathy
David McAuley
31:37
Maxim - old hand?
Maxim Alzoba
31:50
new one, please add to the end of the queue
David McAuley
32:01
ok - Kathy, Zak, and then you
David McAuley
32:25
woops, Kathy, Zak, Greg and then you
Maxim Alzoba
32:58
even the panelists/judge does not know who is the going to be a winner of the particular UDRP/court case
Zak Muscovitch
33:25
Tes.co is a real life example of a UDRP where the Panel foudn confusingly similarity regarding a domain name that corresponded to a trademark as a whole
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
33:30
That was John.
Maxim Alzoba
33:51
@Zak , .co is ccTLD
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
34:03
but .co falls under UDRP
Zak Muscovitch
34:08
Yes, of course.
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
34:29
and panelists apply the same concepts
Maxim Alzoba
34:40
it is a decision of a ccTLD, and not obligatory
Maxim Alzoba
35:00
so it is not working in non UDRP ccTLDs
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
35:15
@Maxim, the the UDRP applies to gTLDs and any ccTLDs that adopt it. The rules are the same.
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
35:27
.CO has adopted the UDRP
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
35:41
(several ccTLDs have)
David McAuley
36:27
Tesco is big
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
36:34
I think a UDRP decision for tes.co (where the use of the domain is considered in a panelist's fact-finding) is probably correct. But I still am concerned about proactive protections.
Maxim Alzoba
36:58
but, if some Republic T… granted with .rt by ISO - not necessary wallma. will be protected by UDRP there
David McAuley
37:14
Greg, are you in queue
David McAuley
37:27
I cant see whole queue
Maxim Alzoba
38:09
TM CANADIAN is Active for few TM owners in WIPO database
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
38:47
@Maxim, right. We can't force any of this on ccTLDs. But for gTLDs, the UDRP does apply.
Kathy Kleiman
39:20
Wal, Joe, Canadian
Kathy Kleiman
39:42
Big implications here...
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
39:44
And panelists are reacting to this, but the reaction is based on use.
Maxim Alzoba
39:47
like 21 of those, if I am not mistaken
John McElwaine
40:02
@Zach the CANADIAN.club will always theoretically be an issue because it is possible to register a trademark in a common word, such as Canadian if used for liquor. In other words, the CLUB portion is not required to register the mark CANADIAN CLUB mark.
Maxim Alzoba
40:15
we can not decide for the UDRP panel, until we are in phase 2
Kathy Kleiman
40:52
David - could you ask Claudio to address teh "Sunrise B" issue?
Kathy Kleiman
40:56
tx!
David McAuley
41:10
yes, i will when I sum up this discussion
Kathy Kleiman
41:40
http://domainincite.com/15422-uniregistry-plans-dot-spanning-sunrise-periods-and-anti-gaming-protection\
Kathy Kleiman
41:50
http://domainincite.com/15422-uniregistry-plans-dot-spanning-sunrise-periods-and-anti-gaming-protection
Kathy Kleiman
41:58
(please use 2nd link)
Susan Payne
42:26
but Maxim, any of those owners of a candian TM could apply in sunrise. they are not being blocked by this proposal
David McAuley
42:28
i will try to sum up for further discussion on thread after Greg
Maxim Alzoba
43:18
My poing is , if Canadian is not in TMCH by Canadian Club (just example), there is no reason to protect it
Philip Corwin
46:04
https://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/search/overview3.0/#item111
Maxim Alzoba
46:49
we may, not necessary can modify the policy
Philip Corwin
46:53
1.11.3 Where the applicable TLD and the second-level portion of the domain name in combination contain the relevant trademark, panels may consider the domain name in its entirety for purposes of assessing confusing similarity (e.g., for a hypothetical TLD “.mark” and a mark “TRADEMARK”, the domain name <trade.mark> would be confusingly similar for UDRP standing purposes).
Kathy Kleiman
47:37
implications for free speech and fair use enormous!!!!
Kathy Kleiman
47:39
Canadian!
Philip Corwin
47:46
Just posted link to and text for relevant portion of WIPO Overview of WIPO Panel Views on Selected UDRP Questions, Third Edition(“WIPO Jurisprudential Overview 3.0”)
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
48:10
As a reminder, the WIPO overview doesn't MAKE UDRP jurisprudence, it's supposed to reflect it. so if we like what panels are doing on this, we should probably give them a "way to go.
David McAuley
48:20
maxim - is that new
Maxim Alzoba
48:26
yes
Kathy Kleiman
48:31
Would Joe's Tattoos even be granted?
David McAuley
48:34
ok, briefly please
Maxim Alzoba
48:41
1 min or less
Kathy Kleiman
48:51
No, DC, Greg :-)
Philip Corwin
49:31
Greg, Ray's Pizza dissents from your last oral statement ;-)
Kathy Kleiman
50:15
I wish Claudio was on chat....
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
51:58
We hear you
Maxim Alzoba
54:18
extension of Sunrise to a year will sufficate all small and medium TLDs (paying all bills without registrations )
Susan Payne
54:51
Maxim did anyone suggest a 1-year sunrise???
Maxim Alzoba
57:05
I potentially misheard Claudio about example of .ASIA
Maxim Alzoba
58:01
and the length of Sunrise there
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
59:31
I think .ASIA had 3-4 sunrise-type periods if i'm not mistaken.
Maxim Alzoba
01:00:17
for example we could not run end date sunrise for legal reasons (so it was first-come-first-served, even with the loss of money comparing to end-date with auctions)
Maxim Alzoba
01:01:06
new hand - 1 min or less required
Susan Payne
01:04:47
@Cl;audio - I agree that there are some challenges when multiple TLDs launch, but that's not really an issue as to the sunrise length, it's an issue about multiple TLDs launching isn't it?
Maxim Alzoba
01:05:10
additional 30 day of doing nothing will result in rise of the prices for all registrations (to recuperate the costs)
Maxim Alzoba
01:05:40
so all members of community pay more to have the particular community protected better
Maxim Alzoba
01:07:41
additional 30 day of ‘notice in advance ’ means that the particular launch plans to be delayed for 30 days more
Susan Payne
01:08:20
what about 5b - have we already done that?
Susan Payne
01:08:49
thanks!
Kathy Kleiman
01:12:55
Is this the right chat room?
Ariel Liang
01:13:04
Hand up
Susan Payne
01:13:11
yes kathy
Kathy Kleiman
01:13:18
Tx coming back in...
Ariel Liang
01:13:43
Hand up for staff
julie.hedlund
01:13:59
@David: Ariel has her hand up and can speak to why we are skipping 5(b)
David McAuley
01:14:04
ok Ariel, thanks
David McAuley
01:14:22
sorry i could not remember, you are next Ariel
David McAuley
01:14:50
Ariel next and then Kathy
Maxim Alzoba
01:14:57
It is hard to enhance SDRP, we can not alter policies of TLDs, only GNSO policies
Maxim Alzoba
01:15:41
TMCH protection is payed protection
Kathy Kleiman
01:16:03
new hand
Maxim Alzoba
01:16:11
and protection of only those TMs, who paid to Deloitte
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:16:11
@Maxim, confusingly, there are TWO SDRPs.
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:16:25
TMCH offers one. RYs have to offer one.
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:16:34
It's a weird relic of the old AG.
Maxim Alzoba
01:19:57
@Kristine, it might be helpful to speak up , so less confusion is in the group
Kathy Kleiman
01:20:14
There is only so much time in the world :-)
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:20:57
@Maxim, sorry I stepped away for a sec.
Maxim Alzoba
01:21:07
I believe George departed from the PDP WG
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:25:20
The applicant guidebook says this about all SDRPs: 6.2.4 The proposed SDRP must allow challenges based on at least the following fourgrounds: (i) at time the challenged domain name was registered, the registrant didnot hold a trademark registration of national effect (or regional effect) or thetrademark had not been court-validated or protected by statute or treaty; (ii) thedomain name is not identical to the mark on which the registrant based its Sunriseregistration; (iii) the trademark registration on which the registrant based its Sunriseregistration is not of national effect (or regional effect) or the trademark had notbeen court-validated or protected by statute or treaty; or (iv) the trademarkregistration on which the domain name registrant based its Sunrise registration didnot issue on or before the effective date of the Registry Agreement and was notapplied for on or before ICANN announced the applications received.
Philip Corwin
01:25:34
George was removed from all GNSO activities by Council Leadership because he would not commit in writing to abiding by the Expected Satndards of Behavior, following a finding by ICANN General Counsel that he had violated the ESB multiple times last year. He can rejoin this WG and GNSO generally whenever he does so.
Maxim Alzoba
01:26:26
I noted that just for sake of clarity (no other intentions)
David McAuley
01:27:10
Thanks Maxim, good chance for me to say why we have the proposals up for comment
Maxim Alzoba
01:28:14
we should not forget that whatever we do, the gaming of RPMs might evolve (water principle), so we are trying to prevent known abuses, and need to ensure we do not create possibility for more than we prevent (in terms of amount)
Maxim Alzoba
01:29:23
can we do doodle? (it will allow for more visibility )
Kristine Dorrain (Amazon Registry)
01:29:34
Thanks David1
Philip Corwin
01:29:36
May 2 would work for me