Joint Session: ALAC and GAC - Shared screen with speaker view
Julia Charvolen - ICANN Org
Hello, my name is Julia Charvolen and I will be monitoring this chat room. In this role, I am the voice for the remote GAC participants.GAC Members who wish to submit a question or comment that you want to be read aloud on the mic, please type your question or comment in English and start with a <QUESTION> and end with a “</QUESTION>” or <COMMENT> </COMMENT>. Text outside these quotes will be considered as part of “chat” and will not be read out loud.Time permitting, we'd like to get to all comments and questions, but we will give priority to comments and questions from GAC members.Be assured that if we don't have time for reading all, the chat transcript is preserved in the meeting records.This session includes “live” interpretation in the 6 UN languages, plus Portuguese.All chat sessions are being archived and follow the ICANN Expected Standards ofBehavior: https://meetings.icann.org/en/expected-standards-behavior.
Herb Waye
Greetings from the Office of the Ombudsman. Our ICANN75 venue office (Executive Suite 1) and virtual office (Zoom) will be open during the AGM meeting hours. Details for the virtual Zoom office are available in the Discussion forum on the main ICANN75 meeting page under the “More” drop down list. We can always be reached by email at ombudsman@icann.org Stay safe and be kind.
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
Good morning
Dorothy Okello UG
Good morning 🌞
Dave Kissoondoyal - ALAC
Hello everyone.
Beatriz Rodriguez-UY
Good morning,/Good night,
Ananda Gautam
Greeting from Nepal 🙂
Jonathan Zuck
Don't have to go that far back, if you consider some of Facebook's efforts to provide internet access, in underserved regions.
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
+1 Jonathan
Pavel Farhan
<QUESTION> What is the Splinternet? For everyone who is not quite familiar with the term, why is it important for them to know the implications of the Splinternet? </QUESTION>
Alberto Soto
+1 Jonathan
Eduardo Díaz (NARALO chair)
The splinternet is a characterization of the Internet as splintering and dividing due to various factors, such as technology, commerce, politics, nationalism, religion, and divergent national interests. (by Wikipedia)
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
@Pavel; hope we may have opportunity to come back to your question; think "Splinternet" generally refers to a broken global Internet replaced by disparate networks perhaps on a geographic basis
Pavel Farhan ICANN75 Fellow
Thank you Eduardo and Nigel
Eduardo Díaz (NARALO chair)
Examples of the splinternet phenomenon are the control of content by the authorities in China, or the blocking of certain U.S. media outlets to users located in Europe as a result of the new data-protection law (General Data Protection Regulation, GDPR) approved by the European Union. (by zorraquino.com)
Pavel Farhan ICANN75 Fellow
follow up <QUESTION> Does the "Splinternet" fall under the category of Internet Fragmentation, as defined by ICANN? Why or Why not? </QUESTION>
Christine Arida - Egypt
This is a 4 year old paper but much of it still holds pretty much today .. it really has a great analysis on the topic : https://www.academia.edu/20523166/William_J_Drake_Vinton_G_Cerf_and_Wolfgang_Kleinw%C3%A4chter_2016_Internet_Fragmentation_An_Overview
It seems Eduardo has misread the GDPR, in which case it is not appropriate to use it as example
Bill Jouris
+1 Jonathan. "Do no harm" is at least something that we may, with difficulty, achieve is many cases. Promoting something that we have been unable to define is a bridge too far.
Holly Raiche
My question is whether ICANN has, in effect, defined Splinternet. What we did hear from Goran, in response to a question, was the issues raise by moving to an ITU governance scenario
Alberto Soto
+1 Eduardo Diaz. And that is just one example of a new tower of Babel, which would turn the Internet into almost an Internet for each interest group, zone, ideology, country, etc. And without interconnection between all of them.
Joanna Kulesza [ALAC EURALO]
A recent interesting take on Closed Generics is also here: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2022/09/giving-big-corporations-closed-generic-top-level-domain-names-run-private-kingdoms
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
On Internet Fragmentation there are various resources referenced on the background for Plenary later.
AR_Gabriela Mattausch
on the issue of closed generics not only "public interest" (concept not yet operationalized) but also "the promotion of competition" is in the interest of governments and established in the Icann Bylaws (section 4.6)
Holly Raiche
There may be a cross over between Jonathan's approach to identify the harms and possible anti-competitive effects of closed genenrics
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
+1; Joanna a good paper indeed.
Jonathan Zuck
Of course, the paper fails to mention there has been no proof of these harms. Look at .TRAVEL and ..JOBS that could be considered canaries in this particular coal mine.
Joanna Kulesza [ALAC EURALO]
+1 @Jonathan, RT#endorsements
Gulten Tepe - ICANN Org
You may find the slides being presented also published on GAC website at; https://gac.icann.org/sessions/icann75-session-10-gac-meeting-with-the-alac
Gulten Tepe - ICANN Org
GAC Members and Observers may also review the briefings posted on the same page (log-in required)
Indonesia ashwin sasongko
Dear Joanna, What ALAC/ Your opinion on the development of large scale IntraNet, that may cover most part of a country, baut connected with ICANN Internet through Gateway(s) for higher Security ?
Indonesia ashwin sasongko
Perhaps other ALAC members may give their opinion on my question above ?
Jonathan Zuck
I think your "intranet" idea is a slippery slope and the risks of censorship and economic discrimination far outweigh any security benefits
Bill Jouris
@Jonathan, that is certainly a constant risk. However there may be occasions/circumstances where the creation of a national Intranet is the most expeditious way to provide access at all to the Internet to broad groups who otherwise would not get it. Or, at least, not get it in a timely manner.
Bill Jouris
In short, the "least bad" option
Alberto Soto
<question> My question for whoever wants to answer. With various possibilities of fragmentation of the Internet: don't you think that at some point Intes becomes a tower of Babel, due to ideologies, personal concepts, governmental, etc., without the possibility of a connection between these fragmentations?<question>
Jonathan Zuck
+1 Susan
Ian Sheldon - GAC Australia
+1 Susan. End user perspective important in this big picture challenge
Internet fragmentation has a direct correlation to the splinternet
Nigel Hickson GAC UK
Yes, indeed as Manal said is it great that proposed process (on having updates re strategic plan) has spurned ALAC interest; and indeed as Manal said no intention to have new structures as such.
Eduardo Díaz (NARALO chair)
Internet fragmentation is composed of many “splinter” nets, hence the splinternet
Holly Raiche
@ Bill. I have really deep reservations about a national intranet - presumably in control of the relevant government - to provide access - to what, decided by whom and in whose interests?
Bill Jouris
@Holly, I'm sensitive to the possible (probable even) downsides. My thought was only that *sometimes* (maybe rarely, but sometimes) the alternative is no access.
Eduardo Díaz (NARALO chair)
The word “splint” is used as a metaphor for something that was part of the whole and is now on its own
Holly Raiche
@ Bill - Maybe the response is to better understand WHY there is no address - and address that issue without constraining the global reach of the Internet
Jonathan Zuck
BJ, it's hard for me to imagine how an intranet gets anyone additional access. You still the need the tools to go online.
Tracy Hackshaw (UPU | .POST)
Congratulations Jonathan and thanks very much Maureen!
Ananda Gautam
thanks for great leadership Maureen
Joanna Kulesza [ALAC EURALO]
Thank you everyone!